Words by Rafe Arnott, photos courtesy of The Little Jerry.
Talk less and listen more is an unspoken code amongst patrons of Japanese listening bars and cafes. This credo helps knit together the social and cultural fabric of these establishments, known as kissa, or kissaten, which flourished across Tokyo and other urban centres of postwar Japan, at one point numbering into the many hundreds. The concept is simple: A small, warm and inviting space serving drinks and coffee or tea, usually with a limited menu and featuring an audiophile-grade sound system for dedicated listening of vinyl LPs (I do a deep dive on the subject HERE).
It is the kissaten which a growing number of ‘listening bars’ and restaurants opening around the globe in the last several years trace their roots to. Venues like London’s Brilliant Corners and Spiritland, Los Angeles’ In Sheep’s Clothing, and Toronto’s The Little Jerry, all pay homage to the blueprint of the humble kissa as part of the formula responsible for their success. Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan run The Little Jerry and describe it as a casual, welcoming space for drinks and food with friends, “which happens to have a high fidelity sound system rather than the system be the entire concept.” I was instantly charmed by the couple and their obviously devoted curation to making The Little Jerry a place to feel at home within their neighbourhood for everyone from audiophiles to epicureans, and all points in-between. I hope you enjoy this interview with them.
Photos below: Left – The Little Jerry from the street. Right – owners Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan.
"The name started as a joke that functioned as a ‘working title’ and stuck as we kept going through the renovations. It fits with our idea of The Little Jerry as a neighbourhood gathering place where various plot lines intersect."
–Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan
Resistor Mag: Who are Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan? What’s their relationship to each other and with music?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “Jodie is a record collector and DJ, Saad is a former photographer and web developer who loves music. We are a couple who initially bonded over our love of losing ourselves on the dance floor. Toronto has a good scene of DIY parties and we probably went out dancing once a week for the first three years we were together. Our record collections and obsession with music have grown the longer we’ve been together. We live in a very noisy apartment above the bar with our cat, Rudy.”
Resistor Mag: Talk to me about your record collections. Are you genre agnostic? Into 12-inch? 45s?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “I’d say pretty genre-agnostic, which reflects what’s played in the bar. We collect a lot of library/ambient records, psych, jazz, and pop. Jodie’s collection has a healthy dose of new wave 12-inch and LPs, with lots of local groups like Rational Youth, Glamor Cult, KonKan etc., some of which are kind of rare but easy to find in Toronto record haunts. Saad leans more towards disco 12-inch and soul 7-inch.”
Resistor Magazine: Each of your five desert island LPs?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “Everyone who works at The Little Jerry is a DJ and/or record collector, so we crowd sourced this question from the staff as a whole:
Photo above: Vintage Klipschorn flank the dining area/dancefloor at The Little Jerry.
Resistor Mag: Describe The Little Jerry. Where is it located? What’s up with the name?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “The Little Jerry is a small-ish neighbourhood bar that has lots of wine and local beer. We also specialize in vermouth, amaro, and cider and have a lovely fish and vegetable-focused menu. It’s pretty chill and we have a wide variety of price points so it’s a good place to grab a few beers with friends or have some food and wine and kind of do it up. People come for a variety of reasons and we have a bunch of local regulars, so the feeling is casual and friendly. We wanted to have a warm and welcoming spot that just happens to have a high fidelity sound system rather than the system be the entire concept. Local record collectors and selectors play records here four or five times a week in a variety of different styles/genres. The goal is to provide a place to experience immersive sound in an unpretentious environment.
“We’re located pretty much smack dab in the middle of Toronto proper near Kensington Market and Little Italy. We are at a major intersection (College & Bathurst) that’s home to a ton of bars, restaurants and clubs. Unfortunately, like much of Toronto, a good portion of the spots on corners are planned to be torn down for condos, one of which is the legendary Sneaky Dee’s. The building we’re in has been spared in the plans, but live music and DJ venues in this city are disappearing at an alarming rate. We are lucky that we have landlords who care about the area and its history as well as our concept. This seems pretty rare in the city (shoutout to Maria and Michael!).
“The name started as a joke that functioned as a ‘working title’ and stuck as we kept going through the renovations. It fits with our idea of The Little Jerry as a neighbourhood gathering place where various plot lines intersect. The pattern if someone asks if it is Seinfeld related is to reply ‘not legally.’”
Photos above: Left - Dancefloor vibes at The Little Jerry. Right – Amp stack, bottom to top: Luxman SQ-N10, Kaiju Bottlehead 300-B, and Dynaco ST-70.
Resistor Mag: What made you want to open a slow-music bar/restaurant? How were you first exposed to the concept?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “Jodie was working as a server and manager in several Toronto restaurants over the years so had exposure to the inner workings of the industry. We are both very sensitive to the auditory aspects of our environment and wanted to work somewhere that thought about sound for the customers (as well as the staff’s benefit, who are there day-in and day-out). We were also keen to work for ourselves and create a place that valued and respected employees and let them be creative.
“We had read about the Jazz Kissa scene in Japan, how the kissaten are scattered about each locality and function as a small respite in which to stimulate all of a person’s senses. Jodie had also been to Brilliant Corners in London, England and loved the music programming, sound, and concept. There’s also a lovely Japanese restaurant in Toronto that’s been open for many years called Imanishi Japanese kitchen which has a JBL sound system and basement listening room. All of these places definitely had an influence on what we were trying to achieve with the space.
“Obviously David Mancuso and The Loft parties are an enormous influence on us and the type of music, sound, and community that we aspire to build. Spots like the former Starvue in Brooklyn run by Cecily Pinkerton and Toronto’s Over and Over parties have also provided inspiration.”
Resistor Mag: Was it a challenge to curate the gear? To integrate it?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “We started out with a pair of 1987 Klipschorn that we bought on Canuck Audio Mart (similar to eBay for used hi-fi gear) and built the rest of the system around them. It was definitely challenging/time consuming to find good quality used equipment for a good price, but we visited a lot of super kitted out hi-fi basements in the Greater Toronto Area and met some very interesting characters in our search. We put the space together on a pretty tight budget but we’ve been committed to improving the system as we learn and grow. On the integration front – the initial (opening) sound-system design accounted for a mostly centralized listening experience around the main seating area. We wanted to fill the other areas of the bar with immersive sound through highly efficient drivers also powered by tubes. It was tricky to get the balance right between 'zones' of the space, so as a person moved through the bar it sounded like an uninterrupted, continuous flow of music with a consistent sonic colour. We were eventually able to achieve this with the gear listed in our sound system details, as well as the addition of a DSP network through which the OJAS and Synergy Horns are run though.
"We’ve also relied on connections we’ve made through the bar, both for equipment and expertise. We haven’t been shy about asking people to help us with what we don’t know. We’ve received indispensable input from sound designer Andrew Carr with the original setup and DJs/hi-fi experts Rob Squire and Dylan McArthur with the upgraded system. There is a very open community of DJs and sound lovers in Toronto who have been generous with their time and advice, and have been the opposite of gatekeepers in a world that can seem difficult to penetrate.”
Photo above: A pair of modded Technics SL-1200s with Jelco TS-550S tonearms and Hana EH cartridges routed through a Condesa Carmen V mixer comprise the analogue front end at The Little Jerry.
Resistor Magazine: Describe The Little Jerry sound system in detail.
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “Our current system consists of two Klipschorn corner horns with Volti VX crossovers, a pair of Sound Physics Labs Synergy Horns, OJAS Bookshelves customized with Azura Horns, and a pair of Klispch La Scala. These are powered by a three-level stack of tube amps; Luxman SQ-N10, Kaiju Bottlehead 300-B, and Dynaco ST-70. Our source is a pair of modded Technics SL-1200s with Jelco TS-550S tonearms and Hana EH cartridges through a Condesa Carmen V mixer. We also have a Rane MP-2016A with XP-2016 external processor hooked up. We give the option to DJs which mixer best suits their needs. The room is sound treated (mostly covered in absorption panels), with built-in bass traps in corners and bulkheads, as well as dispersion panels throughout.”
Resistor Magazine: Is the system evolving?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “I would say that the next thing we plan to tackle is the monitoring system, which sounds great, but has a slightly more compressed and bass forward colour than the rest of the zones. Our monitors are currently Klipsch 'The Sixes' Heritage speakers. Our next step is to find the right monitoring solution given the footprint of the space. While we know it'll never be possible to recreate perfect listening room conditions, we'll continue to look for ways to improve the system and present music in the way its creators intended.”
Photo above: The view from the main bar at The Little Jerry.
Resistor Mag: How has the pandemic affected business? You told me you’ve started selling records too?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “We opened in July, 2019 so we got eight months of business in before the first wave of Covid-19. Since then it’s been intermittent shutdowns/reopenings and getting by. Our municipality has had one of the world's longest lockdowns with indoor drinking/dining business prohibited in intermittent periods for over a year-and-three-months since March 2020. Though it's been tough, we've managed to stay alive acting as a wine/beer shop and small record store through these periods. We are very happy to be open again at half capacity as of last week, and our hope is that we can begin to function normally by the end of this spring. We don’t really translate to a retail shop or takeout operation as the whole point is the atmosphere and soundbath, along with the food and drink.”
Resistor Magazine: Let’s talk food. Your menu looks amazing. Who is the chef?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “Our chef is Declan Edwards. He has a very nuanced way of dealing with ingredients (especially vegetables) that result in really concentrated flavours. As an example, he’ll ferment, dehydrate, and powder celery root and add it to the beurre blanc that accompanies roasted celery root. The dishes here are simple, clever, and casual. We’re all really proud of the menu and everyone who works in the kitchen is an absolute gem. As an aside, I would say that in an international competition of Dad jokes, Declan would definitely reach the podium.”
Resistor Magazine: Who takes care of the wine/beer/cocktail selections?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “Jodie takes care of the wine list and Saad is in charge of the beer side. It’s a nice division of duties. We don’t do cocktails (I know!) but have a large selection of other stuff: amaro, vermouth, cider, etc.”
Photo left: Running lights in effect as The Little Jerry dancefloor gets ready.
Resistor Magazine: Running a place like The Little Jerry could be seen as hugely rewarding and challenging at the same time. Lessons learned?
Jodie Dewald and Saad Qattan: “I’d say one of the main lessons we’ve learned – and thus advice I’d give to other people – is that you don’t need to be an expert or someone well-known in a scene to take a chance and do what you love, especially in the realm of sharing music with others. The audiophile realm can be very intimidating to someone who is just getting into it. Take the first step, stay committed to learning, and go from there.
“It’s also helped to not be too rigid in our ideas of what the space would be and what running it would entail. I think when building a community the people that work in the space, as well as the clientele, help to shape what it becomes and feel a sense of ownership over it as a result. Remaining flexible has also been imperative over the rollercoaster of Covid. It’s been a strange time. We can’t wait to fully reopen and share the space again with all of the lovely people we’ve met these past few years.”
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